Note: Before reading this post, I want to disclose the fact that after I wrote this post
I found out that Dr. Daisey perhaps used some creative license to share the information he gave. It's not that the information about the working conditions is necessarily false, but, from what I can tell, he essentially is telling some true stories and some made-up stories that he believes honestly represents true situations. The information he gives matches with other sources that I have read, so I still think it is still worth thinking about. However, I do wish that he hadn't been somewhat "deceptive" in how he delivered the information.
A couple of my friends linked to
Mr. Daisey and The Apple Factory on Facebook recently, and one friend asked if I had heard it and said:
"Maybe you could do a blog post about "good" vs. "bad" companies: are there any that are responsible third-world employers? What does that even mean? Which major (tech) manufacturers don't use third-world labor?"
Well, I had not yet listened to the radio show, but I had heard of Foxconn and their policies. However, I am going to go ahead and listen to the show (which is about an hour long), and I will make notes as I go in case you don't have an hour to listen to such things. I am taking notes quickly, so let me know if you thing I mistyped something that was said. The notes are in purple, so you can skip them if you just want to see the punchline at the end: I will tell you my findings about "good" and "bad" companies and third-world labor.
- Daisey loves his electronics, but he points out that he rarely thinks about how things are made. He says that he sort of assumed that robots made them. However, he learned that humans are involved in the process, and then he started to think.
- Shenzhen (a city of over 8 million people) is the place in China where almost all our "crap" comes from, yet most of us don't know it's name. We know the stuff's from China, but we don't realize it usually comes from one specific city. Corporations made a deal with the Chinese to help create a modern China. Shenzhen is part of this deal.
- Daisey plans to go to Foxconn which is a company that makes electronics for Apple, Dell, Samsung, Nokia, etc. He plans to stand at the main gate and talk to anybody who wants to talk to him. Journalists in Hong Kong tell him it's a bad idea, but he can't get any information through the normal channels.
- When he got there, he saw that the plant is enormous - 430,000 workers. There are more than 20 cafeterias at the plant each one holding up to 10,000 people. (Try to visualize that!) There are guards at the gate who look "really pissed", and they carry guns.
- Recently a journalist had been beaten for taking pictures near the Foxconn building.
- Daisey was there right after the successive suicides at Foxconn. The nets to catch the suicidal people have been put into place.
- A huge line of people show up to talk to him! They want to tell him the stories of their lives and workplace.
- One lady cleans the screens of I-phones. She's 13 years old. Some of her friends have jobs at Foxconn too. Foxconn doesn't check ages. During an inspection, Foxconn puts the oldest workers on the inspected line.
- Can Apple not know? A company obsessed with the details? Or are they just doing what we're all doing? Do they seek what they want to see?
- His next plan was to visit a bunch of factories, pretend to be a businessman, and pretend to want to buy whatever factories are selling.
- Each factory had gates and guards. Then big green lawns and huge lobbies. The executives come down "in a gaggle" and escort you to a conference room. Then they show you the factory floor. The floors are silent. Nobody is allowed to speak on the line. The only sound is bodies moving constantly.
- Anything that can be made by hand is made by hand because the cost of labor is effectively zero.
- The people he talked to worked 12 hour shifts standard, but often much longer than that. When a "hot new gadget" is coming out, they might work 16 hours or more a day for months. While he's in the country, a Foxconn worker died after working a 34-hour shift. That's not the only case of that happening.
- Dormitories are cement cubes. About 12'x12' with 13-15 beds. There are cameras in the rooms and hallways.
- The way Daisey sees everything is starting to change.
- He notices that things are still "handmade", just not in the way that we always wish things were handmade.
- Runs through his head: "Paranoia is not paranoia if they're actually out to get you." He goes to a restaurant to meet with a union interested in labor reform. These are secret because you can go to prison for years for being involved with one of these unions. He wants to hear what they have to say.
- There is turmoil is Southern China. They helped organize a strike in Honda factories.
- n-hexane is used to clean screens, and it's a known neurotoxin.
- Peoples' joints have disintegrated by the time they are 26 of 27 from doing the same motion over and over and over. Then they are fired.
- If you talk to the labor board about problems, you get put on the black list and you get fired.
- The workers usually never get to see the final product on. A worker said, "It's a kind of magic," when he got to see an I-pad working.
- His partner (Kathy, a Chinese translator) wonders if they are mentally ill. "Are they making it up?" Daisey's answer, "What do you think?" Kathy says, "No... It's just, you hear stories, but you do not think it is going to be so much, you know? It's just so much."
The following is the host's responses and further exploration (I didn't do a terrific job with this section, sorry):
- The host did their best to fact check everything from the excerpt. The host tried to get Apple and Foxconn to respond, but they refused.
- Only one real objection from Ian Spaulding, founder and managing director of INFACT Global Partners, which goes into Chinese factories and helps them meet social responsibility standards set by Western companies: There is child labor in China, but not in top-tier electronics factories. Daisey continues to claim that he met the workers. Not many, but some.
- Apple found 91 under-aged workers in an audit of it's own factories. It helped the kids get back in school, and ended working with one supplier.
- SACOM, Students and Scholars Against Corporate Misbehavior, based in Hong Kong claims:
- The workers are forced to stand to improve productivity
- 10-20% overturn of workers every month
- Workers leaving forces factories to make some improvements
- Apples claims they are 100% transparent, but they refuse to come to the air
- They have a code of conduct the suppliers must comply with, and Apple conducts audits
- If audits don't go well, Apple claims to end work with supplier
- Apple asks suppliers not to use n-hexane
- Daisey is happy they do some things, but he is concerned that even in Apple's own reports, things aren't good. He thinks companies need to be held responsible, but they won't provide supplier names so that people can independently check up on things.
- The question is, "Should we feel weird about buying these things made faraway?"
- Many say no. Sometimes the factories are an improvement from other possibilities (including poverty).
- People say that the factories provide employment opportunities in China, especially for young women. It takes people from the grimness of rice paddies to the grimness of Foxconn.
- Sweatshops are bad, but they help fight poverty.
- "Sweatshops are a phase countries go through."
- Daisey just wants basic worker protection. Rotate people in jobs in factories. Inspect without announcement.
- We fought for these things in our country to protect people. Then we just shipped the jobs to other countries to treat other people as poorly.
"Out of sight, out of mind..."
First of all, the ethics of electronics goes way beyond the serious labor issues. I just read
The Story of Stuff recently, and I learned a lot about electronics. (I
highly recommend that book, by the way!) The ethical issues begin with sourcing of materials which often damages natural resources in other countries and even forces people off of their land, and the issues end with the fact that electronics are often sent to China at the end of their lifetimes where they are recycled by workers who are not properly equipped to be dealing with the toxins and other nasties that the electronics are filled with. From beginning to end, and all the way throughout the process, the manufacturing of electronics is a messy process that maybe should probably turn some heads.
Now back to the original concern. I am similar to Daisey in that I think that we should care that people are not being treated well as they make all of our "crap". However, in my research, it is really hard to label any company as "good" or "bad". I have read that HP does a fair amount to try to be "good", but even HP is not close to perfect when it comes to helping the environment or people.
So what should we buy? There is no black-or-white answer here! However, first of all, buying used or refurbished is probably best for the environment and people. Additionally, buying fewer electronic gadgets in general is an option. If you are going to buy something new, though, you might want to check it out on the
Good Guide which is an amazing site (recommended by the author of
The Story of Stuff, Annie Leonard). You can get the Good Guide to rank potential purchases by different issues (environment, society, health, etc).
Other sites that I found interesting:
Good luck to all of you who are interested in being an ethical consumer! It's not always clear what the best decision is, I don't think, but I personally think that if we choose to work to improve things, things will get better. At the very least, let's not have the "out of sight, out of mind" mentality anymore. Let's keep this in the open and keep discussing things because we want to make the world better for everyone. Additionally, feel free to contact companies when you question their values. Let them know if you choose another company over theirs because companies
will respond to consumer pressure.
